i don't know how much credit should be given to whom. and i understand that there are other musicians, engineers and mixers involved. sounds like you have much better idea of what's going on behind the scenes. but, i was asuming that it's all done under reznor's direction. i'll just say then that several of NIN records fall into that 'sonic genius' catagory for me. for steve H? not so much. ha!
i just saw NIN in st. louis a couple weeks ago. it was a good show, and i've been fan since '91.
but, for Lure, it should be mentioned that Trent isn't sitting in a room by himself recording/creating the NIN albums. i give all the credit in the world to him for his creativity, but if you go album by album, the producers, engineers, and mixers are the ones who should be given the title of "sonic genius", trent just approves what they do and puts it on his album. even the countless studio musicians who work in alternate rooms creating tones and samples, etc, don't really get credit they deserve. above all if a term like "sonic genius" is going to be used, then the only person i see that fitting for is Alan Moulder, who's mixed/assembled most of the NIN songs since Downward Spiral.
and i think i get (and agree) with what art is saying. this IS a cool poster, no doubt. but i think NIN is very diffcult to capture visually although it does seem like it would be easy. i don't think i've seen it done yet.
NIN so do NOT suck. i'm not generally an 'industrial' fan. but nin is one of my favorite 'bands.' i saw them in orlando last week. amazing live, just playing as a rock band. but, in the studio, trent rezor is a sonic genius.
dunno either. i said i thought these nin posters weren't very good. that seemed to solicit an avanlanche of disagreement. but, now, most people seem to be saying the same thing about these nin posters. great band with weak posters. so, what else is new?
i swear to god you are getting crazy. i've DO NOT know trent and have never claimed to. i know posters. that's what this discussion is about - posters, not "how well we know trent". you only see what you want to be true.
geez. what a vile idiot.
i read your response a few times and i can't help feeling we're basically in a greement. you're sorta re-inforing my point. the difference is that you come down on the side that "it's his music, so it's his artwork and he can do whjat he wants". i come down on a soide that sez, "it's my job to help communicate his ideas better, even if he doesn't understand." i think that's where we disagree.
of course, you don't (nobody does) like having any sort of criticism of their work (myself included). so, your defensiveness is understandable. however, i still feel exactly the same way. this is not a good poster for NIN. none of these new posters are any good for NIN.
I get you, Art.
Dont think anything was 'unchallenged'...
after a while tho, you give the client what he wants...at the very least, because you're both running out of time.
And yet, if NIN is Trent's thing...and he likes a certain 'look'...he feels this look says NIN...who are we to call him wrong? If design is a language...and Trent's chosen designs successfully speak to millions of people...whether someone 'trained' in 'correct' design believes it or not...its GOOD DESIGN. Because good design effectively communicates an idea.
And if the guy that has the 'idea' decides that its best communicated in THIS way or THAT way...and its how he saw it in his head when it was still only his idea...he has to have sovereign opinion in it.
If tons of people co-sign on his beliefs by LIKING and RESPONDING to the design language...he wins. He was RIGHT...even if we personally dont agree with him.
In a sense, all he does need is one person who DOES respond to justify his vision.
oh, i know a LOT about trent. no, i've never worked with him, but i've worked AROUND him on a few occassions (if you understand). he's an odd duck (in many ways), but not impossible. i've worked with far far more difficult artists and still been able to do good work.
at any rate, this may bee a case of too much unchallenfged power in the hands of someone who doesn't quite 'get it' all that well. a lot of bands i've wortked with over the years really really thought they knew exactly what they were about and what they were doing. and when they explained it, they had no idea what they were doing. they are usually fishing for ideas and directions. then it's the job of the visual artist to "train" them and lead them into solutions. it's part of the job. done it a million times. it's always a drag, but when it works well, it can be very satisfying.
savvy? i know - IT"S JUST A POSTER. but, you'd be amazed how 'just a poster' can change the direction of a creative vision.
I get what youre saying...but you dont know the whole story. Ask anyone whos worked directly with Trent and you'll learn that Trent controls EVERYTHING. That leaves the vaguely abstract as an artists only option when working for him.
Then again, Ive gotten several emails from NIN fans saying, 'Ive GOT to get this one...' some of them even saying they know what song it is/was based on.
So, your opinion, while I respect it, is yours. ONE out of literally millions...no more valid or invalid than anyone elses.
you did this? well, it's better than most NIN posters. but, it's still not quite there, yet. like i said, you'd think a NIN poster would be easy to do, but it's not. none of these new things are really where they need to be as far as reflecting anything about the music, the history or the band. sorry, dude. that's my opinion.
'jermaine, did those chains prevent this from being sold at the show? saw one in the window of my former employer the other day. very nice!'
No...the chains were how many I can make available to collectors. NIN paid for this poster as promotion and PR. Trent made the payment substantial enough that I agreed to only sell a handful...which I will do.
There are also handbills of this design that were all over the place. No, I dont have any.
i use the posters i get for promotion. well, i keep one for me and the club and promoter but i mostly hang em inside the club where people cant take em and then day of show i put em out around the club and see how long they last.
maybe it aint creepy... maybe the dude WANTS to be held by that mutant ugly fuck,... his left hand seems to indicate this... this might be a love story
i am learning how to read jermaine posters yo!
cue the raccoons!
hey beto, that's actually how the type on all the admats for the tour look like. it may not have been up to jermaine to mess with.
the circuit creature makes me think of a cross between hexadecimal(from reboot) and magus(warlock's dad from x-men/new mutants).
that thing on top of the head of that 'thing' bugs the shit out of me... is the perspective or whatever you call that wrong or something? ...
if i were that dude i'd try to find the 'off' switch... every machine has one of those
'2 out of the 3 bands rule.....too bad their names are the small ones.'
The 'big name' footed the tab for this poster, tho...so I aint mad at em.
Approx. 33x23 inches, BTW...printed on French Speckletone Oatmeal...Black, 808U green, and white.